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Human Rights In Russia? How about America?

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  #15 (permalink)  
Old 21st May 2005, 00:55
mikeaverko mikeaverko is offline
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Note the non-substantive personal attack post by "moderator" Voyager.

Not the first one from him/her. He/she does this while ignoring the blatant fact based flaws of another moderator Dobko (Demagogue).

On the matter of other forums and "human rights," here's another thread which I initiated:

LYING ABOUT RUSSIA
http://talk.guardian.co.uk/WebX?14@1....2@.77473289/0

6,913 posts since 7/28/04.
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  #16 (permalink)  
Old 22nd May 2005, 04:11
rasputinisgod rasputinisgod is offline
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I used to be a Christian. Now, I hope for its demise out of the United States. Only then will Americans have the right to talk about freedom because Christianity is against the very idea of personal liberty and tolerance for the outcast.
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  #17 (permalink)  
Old 9th November 2005, 22:58
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Verbatim Verbatim is offline
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As a lawyer, I am dismayed by people making such unappealable accusations while not knowing squat about the subject matter. "Probable cause" is a legal term which entails two aspects: (1) cause; and (2) probability that a crime has been committed or is being committed. Last I heard, Russian cops do not need any cause to stop and terrorize people on the street -- and that was also my experience in the Soviet Union.

"Freedom" does not mean that you can take your pants down and pee in the middle of Times Square. It is not a "human right" to sell drugs out of your car, or to go on a killing spree in the red light district. I would not be surprised if such "freedoms" exist in Russia, given the level of corruption in the Russian law enforcement; but I wonder how "free" that makes those people who find themselves on the receiving end of drug dealers' and murderers' exercise of their "human rights".

Yes, American cops can stop you if they have at least an articulable basis to believe that your car is rigged with explosives and you are heading to Holland Tunnel to bomb it. (Newsflash: Bombing the Holland Tunnel isn't a "human right" either.) If Russian cops have a similar suspicion, they will stop you as well. There are two major differences, however: (1) in Russia, a bribe in the sum of $50 or $100 will probably send you on your way to martyrdom; and (2) in the US, the cops' findings really are subject to challenge in court (and are in fact successfully challenged every day).

True, America has Christian fundamentalists -- but they are neither as strong nor as numerous as Communists in Russia, who clamor for a return to a totalitarian state (where your human rights are zealously observed, especially after they humanly torture and kill you). Americans wear their hearts and their guilt on their sleeve; Russians only wear their wounded pride. America absolutely sucks at creating Potemkin villages; Russia invented Potemkin villages and is a virtuoso at pulling the veil over the eyes of my well-intentioned, but ignorant and naive fellow Americans.

"Freedom", my friends, means a right to due process -- a concept so alien to Russian legal culture, that it is untranslatable; and when it comes to substantive due process, it is moreover inexplicable. As for "human rights" -- it is anybody's guess what they are. The concept has been so diluted with various kinds of demagogy (mostly from European relativists), that it means whatever one wants it to mean -- which is to say nothing. In this post, however, I was relying on the original understanding of what basic human rights are -- life, liberty, property, and due process before any of these three are taken away.

If you are saying there is no freedom of expression in America -- please provide me with a list of people who have been executed for criticizing the government in the past year. Much obliged. Otherwise, it's all BS and *****ing, and no facts.
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  #18 (permalink)  
Old 12th December 2005, 20:20
cacalex cacalex is offline
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Liberty ???

The only liberty offered by USA and/or capitalism is resume here :

You're free to work your ass 5 days a week, to have only 1 day of real freedom... 'cause you have to do boring stuff like laundry, grocery, and all in all, it takes at least a day... So (if you are lucky) you'll probably have only sunday to really live your life...

Personal experience here... Anyone dare to comment ???

By the way, I'm in Canada...
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  #19 (permalink)  
Old 15th December 2005, 06:10
Voyager13b Voyager13b is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cacalex
Liberty ???

The only liberty offered by USA and/or capitalism is resume here :

You're free to work your ass 5 days a week, to have only 1 day of real freedom... 'cause you have to do boring stuff like laundry, grocery, and all in all, it takes at least a day... So (if you are lucky) you'll probably have only sunday to really live your life...

Personal experience here... Anyone dare to comment ???

By the way, I'm in Canada...
Your declaration proclaimed that you don't have a clue about life in less free countries. Even your beloved Canada is little different from the USA when it comes to daily living. I work five days each week and enjoy what I do. I find time to shop, do laundry, type at my keyboard, cook, visit friends, and gernerally have a good time during my work week. On the weekends, I tend to sleep late, stay up late, and pretty much do as I please for two days in a row.

If you don't enjoy your work, find another job. You spend a lot of time at work during your life, and there is no sense in wasting it at something you hate doing. As for the other BS claims you made about not being able to do chores during the week, I have no problem, as I stated at the begining. Considering the fact that commerce is more than robust during the work week, I think most people are quite able to get things done after work without great mental stress. Where did you go wrong?

No matter where you live, you will have to work in order to earn money. Money puts food on the table, toys in your hands, and makes your family feel secure. It will take up a great portion of your life, so get used to it. The alternative to civilization and the concept of money is to live off the land, and fend for yourself. Considering that you can't even find the time to wash your clothes during a normal work week, I doubt you would last more than a Month as a free hunter-gatherer.

The bottom line is that you have to work to survive, no matter what. Countries that used to exempt lazy people from working are going broke, so that option isn't too viable any more. Working people are tired of supporting lazy people. Even in a communist paradise (sic), people had to work, and had to work hard to earn their state support. Many of them still lived like peasants compared to to the west, and had no more free time on their hands to show for it. The best deals offered to lazy people were always found in the west. Countries like many of those that make up old Europe built a huge cash flow with capitalist ideals. The socialists appealed to the population in the fashion that a porn site appeals to a pervert over time, and after a few decades, the countries have been going broke. Someone has to pay for everything "given" by a government. That means that the working population pays the way. As more people offer little or nothing in the form of work, the burden on the working people grows.

Too bad that the lazy people can also vote, as politicians promise to spend more of the money earned by the working class in order to lock in votes by the lazy people. Politicians tend to be most interested in keeping their jobs, so it is natural to pander to lazy slobs who will be more than happy to cast their vote in return for a handout. That worked for many decades, as capitalist nations were so productive overall that the diversion of funds to buy votes went unnoticed for the most part. The downside is that the current ratio of people who work for a living, vs people who either work for the government, or are supported by the government in some manner has become untennable in recent years.

I suggest that you find a job that you like, vote to prevent the never ending assault on your earnings by your government, and organize your time in a way that will allow you freedom on the weekends. The moocher alternative seems to be on it's way out of favor...

Voyager
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  #20 (permalink)  
Old 29th January 2006, 22:22
zes zes is offline
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I agree the US has some messes in Human Rights sector of the country... Needs to be cleaned up a bit...
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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 7th March 2006, 08:02
jutka jutka is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cacalex
Liberty ???

The only liberty offered by USA and/or capitalism is resume here :

You're free to work your ass 5 days a week, to have only 1 day of real freedom... 'cause you have to do boring stuff like laundry, grocery, and all in all, it takes at least a day... So (if you are lucky) you'll probably have only sunday to really live your life...

Personal experience here... Anyone dare to comment ???

By the way, I'm in Canada...
Boohoo cry me a freaking river - you work 5 days a week? Big deal!! What do you expect, a nobel prize?
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